Sunday, April 6, 2025

ARP348 Creating Congress, 1787


Last week we covered the most controversial issue of the Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia in 1787.  That was whether states should be represented in Congress by population or with equal representation for each state.  The convention ended up splitting the difference, giving population representation in the House and equal representation in the Senate.

One or Two Houses

To reach that final agreement, however, the delegates had to agree to having two houses in the first place.  While this issue was not nearly as heated as the controversial as the proportionality question, it did go through some back and forth.

The initial Virginia Plan, written by James Madison, had recommended two houses, what we call a bicameral legislature.  Madison considered this to be an important check on a potentially runaway majority.  Although the Confederation had operated with a single house, Madison saw that as a problem.  Eleven of the thirteen states had bicameral legislatures.  Only Pennsylvania and Georgia had a single house.  Of course, Britain, the model for so many things, had two houses: a House of Commons and a House of Lords.

For most supporters of two houses, the idea of an upper house kept the more intemperate voices of the people in the lower house from going too far.  Short term popular majorities, often led by a charismatic figure, might gain a majority at times.  There was a need to keep them in check.

Supporters of a single house essentially agreed with the purpose of the upper house, but said that it was a bug rather than a feature.  Having one house of the legislature made up of elites who could thwart the will of the majority went against everything that a democratic republic meant.  Rule by the people meant that the people should be able to implement the laws that they wanted without a tiny minority of rich old guys standing in their way.

Because the delegates voted general support for the Virginia plan to become the basis of their consideration and because the Virginia plan called for two houses, that became the basis for most discussions.  The equal states delegates were also the delegates who had originally wanted a single body legislature.  After the majority of the convention voted for proportional representation in both houses, the equal state folks also got behind the idea of a two house legislature so that at least one of them would offer equal representation.  So, by a month or so into the convention, pretty much everyone was on board with a proposal that included two houses. There remained debates over how those two houses would be populated but the decision to have to houses had pretty much reached a consensus by that point.

Terms of Office

A big issue was how long a term of office should be. Many delegates wanted a term of one year.  In fact, Massachusetts had instructed its delegates to demand a single year term and also to allow states to recall members during the year if they wanted.  For many, these regular elections - which were the norm in most state legislatures at the time, were a way of ensuring that representatives always reflected the will of the people.  Too much time between elections meant more time to get swayed by others in Congress, rather than listening to constituents.

Under the Articles of Confederation, appointments to the Continental Congress were annual, and subject to recall.  Of course, there was no requirement that they be elected. In most cases, the governor or state legislature appointed delegates to the Confederation Congress.

The Virginia plan as introduced literally left this blank.  The plan read “the members of the first branch of the National Legislature ought to be elected by the people of the several States every __  for the term of __.”

Others thought that one year terms were a mistake. Daniel of St. Thomas Jenifer of Maryland proposed three year terms, arguing that annual elections made people indifferent to them and that it made it more difficult to find candidates willing to run with such frequency.  

Madison and Hamilton also supported three year terms.  They, and others, argued that congressmen needed time to understand how the government worked, and that a constant churn would prevent that.  There was also the time it took to travel to the nation’s capital.  Having to return home all the time for elections would prove difficult. In the end, the Convention compromised on two year terms for the House.

In the Senate, there was a whole range of proposed term lengths, proposals included, three, four, five, seven, nine years, and even lifetime appointments.  These were supposed to be wise statesmen who were somewhat detached from the people and who could serve as a check on the House when it went too far.  Much of the debate compared Senate terms to those in the British Parliament, which were seven years.  Madison wanted nine year terms so that they would line up with the three year terms that he wanted in the House. Having terms that didn’t line up meant that elections could not be held together in the same year.  When the House terms were reduced from three years to two, Madison also accepted the idea that Senate terms should be six years, so that a Senator would still stand for election in one out of three elections.

Senators would be selected by state governments rather than elected directly.  The Virginia Plan had recommended that Senators be chosen by members of the house.  Pretty early on though, the overwhelming majority of delegates wanted state governments to choose their Senators.  The Senate would serve as a protection of state sovereignty within the federal government. There wasn’t really any support for direct election of Senators.  

Term limits

The Convention debated whether either house should have term limits or be subject to recall.  Under the Articles of Confederation, appointed delegates could be recalled at any time during their one year terms.  Further, no one under the Articles of Confederation could serve more than three terms in a row in Congress.

Debate over the power to recall members of the House or Senate never got much traction.  Although a vocal minority liked the idea, the notion of recalling representatives mid-session and having to hold new elections to replace them, was considered unworkable.  Beyond that many delegates wanted representatives to have a greater ability to act independent of popular opinion back home.  Voters at home were not privy to all the debates and reasons for decisions that representatives would have. As a result, representatives had to be free to use their own best judgment on matters.

There was probably a better case for recalling Senators.  After all, they had six year terms if they proved unpopular, and since the state legislature appointed them, it would be easy to appoint a replacement.  But the nationalists wanted the Senate to be a body of wise and deliberative men who were aloof from factional majorities that might form in the House.  These wiser independent leaders should not be looking at popular disapproval for their actions.  That was why some delegates wanted to give them lifetime tenure.  In the end, they would have to face reappointment every six years, but could not be recalled short of that.

For similar reasons, the Convention did not allow states to saddle representatives with instructions.  Many state governments had gotten used to the idea of instructing their delegates on how to vote.  Supporters of the new federal system believed that representatives should be able to use their own judgment, and not be hamstrung by rules imposed by people back home who were not part of the national debates.  Most of the people serving in this convention had served as delegates under the articles of Confederation and had experienced frustration of such instructions.

The delegates also rejected the idea of term limits. The Virginia plan had initially anticipated some term limits on members of congress.  Madison also proposed at one point that members of congress be ineligible for any other federal office for at least one year after leaving office.  He saw this as a way to prevent members from creating government jobs for themselves.

In the end though, the delegates rejected all of this.  The states voted unanimously against term limits. From their perspective, the term limit rules in the Articles of Confederation had proven to be a disaster.  Those limits essentially sidelined some of the best delegates from further service, while putting up the B team to continue to represent their state.  Members could continue to run for office as long as the people continued to reelect them.

Citizenship, Residency, and Age

The Convention also considered other restrictions on members of Congress, beyond being able to win an election.  A big one was whether immigrants could serve in Congress.  This raised some debate.  Hamilton, in particular, strongly opposed a proposal to restrict members of Congress to native born Americans.  Some have argued that he did this out of self-interest, since he had been born in the West Indies.  Hamilton, however, probably would have been eligible since he was a citizen when the US was created.  Hamilton was more concerned that highly qualified people from Europe might immigrate and would be able to add greatly to the nation through government service.  They should not be prevented from running.  That should be left up to the voters.

Supporters of requiring elected officials be native born or longtime citizens argued that outsiders could come into the government and change it based on their attachments to their home countries and also with foreign ideas that were incompatible with the American form of government.  There were considerable debates on how long to require an immigrant to be a citizen before they could run for office.

In the end, the delegates agreed that all members of the House and Senate should be citizens.  They initially placed a restriction that members must be a citizen for at least three years before holding office.  In the final version they changed this to seven years.  For the Senate, they settled on nine years.

There was also a question of residency.  Could an outsider, say a member of another state or district move into an area immediately run for office? Some delegates thought there should be some period of years before someone could run for office, so that they truly represented those who elected them.  In the end, the Convention required that an elected official reside in the state that they want to represent. There was no waiting requirement.  If the official became an inhabitant of the state just before the election, that was good enough.

Delegates also considered age restrictions.  There were some, like Wilson who argued for no restrictions on age.  If a candidate gained the confidence of the voters, even at a very young age, youth should not bar him from serving.  Initially, the delegates set the age at 21.  That was the traditional age of adulthood, when a man could make contracts and do other things under the law.  

George Mason, however, argued it should be set higher limits.  Mason argued a man should not move from being considered a child one day to be able to represent people in government the next.  Mason, who was aged 62 at the time, also noted that he looked back on his foolish mistakes of youth in his early twenties, and believed that everyone would become wiser with age. He moved that the minimum age be set at 25.  In the end a majority of states agreed seven states to three, to set the minimum age for the House at 25.

Delegates also argued over a higher age for Senators.  The Senate was to be a place for more mature, stable, and experienced men.  Despite the fact that several delegates at the convention that was making these rules were still in their twenties, the delegates voted to set a minimum age of 30 for Senators.

Leadership

There seems to have been little debate over how each house would choose its leaders.  Neither the Virginia Plan, nor the New Jersey Plan even addressed the issue.  There was a general consensus that the House of Representatives would choose its own leader, called a Speaker.  This was based on the British Speaker of the House of Commons.  The House also received the power to create other officers as it deemed necessary.  The details of all this was left up to the House itself.

There was not much thought at all given to the leader of the Senate.  It was typical that in most state upper houses or in the House of Lords in Britain, that there was no leader.  These bodies were small enough and collegial enough that they didn’t necessarily need a leader.

It wasn’t until near the end of the Convention when the Committee on Unfinished Parts proposed that the Vice President preside over the Senate.  The main reason for doing this was to give the Vice President something to do.  There were some objections.  Elbridge Gerry of Massachusetts argued that this would be akin to placing the President in charge of the legislature and that it would destroy the independence of the legislature.  Similarly, George Mason of Virginia argued that it was mixing the legislative and executive branches, which should be kept separate.

Others, however, pointed out that if the Senate chose one of its own to lead, that one state would be denied one of its two votes in the Senate, except in cases of a tie.  The convention voted to let the Vice President sit as the ex officio President of the Senate, although the final wording just said he would sit as the President of the Senate.

Rules and Punishment

The Convention also established that each house would have the power to set rules for itself and to punish its own members.  They did not want outsiders to be able to intervene in the operations of the House and Senate.  Both the House and Senate were given the power to expel their own members, again without any outside involvement.  Madison recommended requiring a two-thirds vote for expulsion in order to prevent extremely factionalized majorities from removing minority members they did not like.  The majority agreed with Madison.

I think it is important to note however, that other branches of government had no power to remove members of Congress.  Contrast this with the fact that Congress gave itself the power to remove any member of the executive or judicial branches through impeachment.  Congress was meant to be the branch of government with the most control over all three branches of goverment.

Powers of Congress

While the Convention allowed states to set elections, it also gave Congress the power to overrule state election dates and mandate its own date for federal elections.  It gave each house the authority to judge the results of the elections of its members, again, without any interference from the other branches.

Further, members, with some exceptions, would not be subject to arrest while Congress was in session, or while traveling to or from sessions of Congress.  Members also could not be questioned anywhere else for speech and debate made in Congress.  Delegates were well aware that by creating other branches of government, those branches might try to interfere with Congress, or attack individual members.  Congress tried to put limits on that possibility.

Another rule was that all bills for raising revenue had to originate in the House, not the Senate.  You may ask, what does it matter since both houses would have to approve it anyway?  Part of the argument was that the House was closest to the people and representative of the people.  That whole taxation without representation thing meant that the house that represented the people should control proposals to raise taxes.  

When the Convention was debating the interests of large vs. small states, some of the large states argued that it was unfair that smaller states, contributing far less in taxes, should have equal power in originating money bills.  In response, this rule about the house originating all bills raising revenue, was given to the large state faction.  Of course, though, it was meaningless since the Senate could amend any such bill to say whatever it wanted, then send it back to the House.

Both houses would have to pass all laws, although the power to make treaties and appoint members of the other branches was limited to the Senate.  We'll get into that more next week when we discuss the executive branch.

The Convention also listed the specific powers which the Congress, would have.  Number one was borrowing money, which had been much of the purpose of the Continental Congress.  The second thing listed was regulating commerce, both at home and abroad.  Recall that this was the primary goal at the Annapolis convention and played such a large role in creating the demand for this convention.  It also gave Congress the power to establish uniform rules of naturalization, so that states did not create their own.  

There were a great many financial powers for congress.  Establishing bankruptcy rules, coining money, punishment of counterfeiting were all given to Congress, probably with an eye toward preventing financial abuses like Rhode Island had committed in recent years.  It explicitly took away the power of states to make their own money or create a new legal tender.

Congress had the power to declare war, raise armies and navies, deal with crimes on the high seas.  It shared with states the power to arm and regulate militia.  It denied states the power to enter into foreign treaties, grant letters of marque, etc.  They could not maintain standing armies or ships of war.  The new Federal government would have exclusive power related to war and foreign policy.   

Finally, the Convention granted Congress exclusive power of a district which would become the seat of government.  After their experience in Philadelphia where local officials had refused to protect Congress from angry Continental soldiers, the delegates wanted to be sure that Congress could regulate its own local government.  The Constitution did not specify where this district would be, but did call on states to cede the land to make it into an independent jurisdiction controlled by Congress.

Next week, we will turn our attention to what the Convention thought an executive branch should look like.

- - -

Next Episode 349 Creating a President, 1787 (coming soon)

Previous Episode 347 The Convention's Biggest Fight

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Further Reading

Websites

Secret Proceedings and Debates of the Convention Assembled at Philadelphia, in the Year 1787, Richmond; Wilbur Curtiss, 1839. 

Brant, Irving James Madison: Father of the Constitution, 1787-1800. Bobbs-Merrill Co. 1950 (borrow only). 

Donovan, Frank R. Mr. Madison’s Constitution: The Story Behind the Constitutional Convention, New York: Dodd, Mead & Co. 1965 (borrow only) 

Farrand, Max The Framing of the Constitution of the United States, Yale Univ. Press, 1913. 

Farrand, Max (ed) The Records of the Federal Convention of 1787Vol. 1Vol. 2, and Vol 3, Yale Univ. Press, 1911.  

Ford, Worthington, Chauncey The Federal Constitution in Virginia, 1787-1788. Cambridge: University Press, 1903. 

Jameson, J. Franklin Studies in the History of the Federal Convention of 1787, Washington: Government Printing Office, 1903. 

Madison, James Notes of Debates in the Federal Convention of 1787, Ohio Univ. Press, 1966. 

McMaster, John Bach (ed) Pennsylvania and the Federal Constitution: 1787-1788, Historical Society of Pennsylvania, 1888. 

Meigs, William M. The Growth of the Constitution in the Federal Convention of 1787, Philadelphia: J.B. Lippincott Co. 1900. 

Richardson, Hamilton P. The Journal of the Federal Convention of 1787 Analyzed, San Francisco: Murdock Press, 1899. 

Scott, James B. James Madison's notes of debates in the Federal convention of 1787, New York: Oxford Univ. Press, 1918. 

Books Worth Buying
(links to Amazon.com unless otherwise noted)*

Amar, Akhil Reed America’s Constitution: A Biography, Random House 2005. 

Beeman, Richard R. Plain, Honest Men: The Making of the American Constitution, Random House, 2009. 

Bowen, Catherine Drinker Miracle at Philadelphia: The Story of the Constitutional Convention, Little, Brown & Co. 1966 (borrow at archive.org).

Collier, Christopher Decision in Philadelphia: The Constitutional Convention of 1787, Random House, 1986 (borrow at archive.org).

Morris, Richard B. Witnesses at the Creation: Hamilton, Madison, Jay and the Constitution, Holt, Rinehart & Winston, 1985. 

Rossiter, Clinton 1787: The Grand Convention, Macmillan Co. 1966 (borrow on archive.org).

Smith, Page The Constitution: A Documentary and Narrative History, Morrow Quill, 1978. 

Stewart, David O. The Summer of 1787: The Men Who Invented the Constitution, Simon & Schuster, 2007. 

* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

Sunday, March 30, 2025

AR-SP31 The Ride, with Kostya Kennedy

 

In March, 2025, author Kostya Kennedy joined our American Revolution Roundtable to discuss his new book: The Ride: Paul Revere and the Night That Saved Americawhich has just been released.

This is a brief summary of our one hour discussion.

This special edition of the American Revolution podcast features a discussion with author Kia Kennedy about his new book, "The Ride, Paul Revere, and The Night That Saved America". The discussion centers around the events leading up to the Battles of Lexington and Concord and Paul Revere's crucial role.

Kennedy was drawn to Revere both personally, recalling his childhood fascination with Longfellow's poem, and intellectually, admiring Revere's ability to rise to the occasion during a pivotal moment in history. Unlike many other Founding Fathers who were wealthy and educated elites, Revere was a tradesman, a silversmith, which makes his close relationships with figures like John Hancock, Samuel Adams, and Dr. Joseph Warren remarkable.

Freemasonry played a significant role in Revere's life, initially as a networking opportunity for his business and later as a forum for exchanging ideas. Although there were different lodges with varying social demographics, their charters and agendas were not explicitly political, but rather social groupings.

The enduring fame of Paul Revere is largely attributed to Longfellow's poem, written 85 years later as a call to action against slavery. While the poem took some poetic liberties, it captured the spirit of Revere's actions and transformed him into a powerful symbol and rallying cry that continues to be used today. Even without the poem, Revere was considered the principal rider of the revolution prior to his famous ride.

The discussion addresses the historical treatment of William Dawes, the other rider that night. While Dawes is sometimes presented as having been unjustly overshadowed by Revere, the sources suggest that Revere was the primary figure who successfully alerted the countryside. Revere himself mentioned Dawes in his account. The idea that Revere was drunk or ineffective is considered "poppycock".

The events leading up to the ride, including the Powder Alarm, highlighted the need for a rapid response system among the Patriots. It is suspected that Revere played a key role in organizing a "phone tree" system to quickly mobilize the militia. Revere was a trusted messenger for the Patriots, delivering news about the Powder Alarm to Philadelphia. The use of lanterns in the Old North Church was another method, devised by Revere, to signal the British movements.

On the night of April 18th, 1775, Joseph Warren dispatched both Revere and Dawes to warn Hancock and Adams in Lexington about the movement of British troops from Boston. Revere crossed Boston Harbor by boat, evading British naval ships, while Dawes left Boston via land before the curfew. Revere arrived in Lexington before Dawes despite leaving later and facing more obstacles.

On their way to Concord, Revere and Dawes were joined by Samuel Prescott. The three were intercepted by British soldiers, leading to Revere's capture. Prescott was the only one of the three to reach Concord and alert the town. Revere, during his capture, informed the British soldiers about the impending Patriot response. The British captors eventually released Revere and the other captured Patriots as they realized their vulnerable position.

The discussion touches on the motivations of British General Thomas Gage, who, despite orders from London, was hesitant to arrest Patriot leaders like Hancock and Adams, possibly fearing it would ignite a war before reinforcements arrived. Gage likely viewed the expedition to Lexington and Concord as another raid to secure arms, similar to events at Portsmouth and the Powder Alarm. However, the Patriots' organized response, as seen in Leslie's Retreat and the retrieval of arms from Portsmouth by Revere, demonstrated their preparedness.

The participants also discuss the Minutemen, a select subgroup of the militia who were prepared to mobilize at a moment's notice.

Financially, Revere was paid for his services as a rider and had earned a good income as a silversmith earlier in his life. John Hancock was a significant financier of the Patriot movement.

The discussion briefly considers an alternative historical scenario where the British successfully captured Hancock and Adams and seized the stores at Concord. The consensus is that this would have been a devastating blow to the Patriot cause, potentially delaying American independence significantly. However, it is also argued that the Patriot spirit of resistance would likely have persisted.

The location where Hancock and Adams went after the battles was Woburn. Revere returned to Lexington to retrieve Hancock's forgotten trunk, which contained important Patriot papers, and was present when the first shots were fired.

There is no known direct meeting between George Washington and Paul Revere, although Revere was involved in the Massachusetts militia and may have had indirect contact.

The discussion briefly addresses Revere's involvement in dentistry and how it later helped identify Dr. Warren's body.

When asked about comparisons to David Hackett Fischer's book on the subject, Kennedy expressed respect for the work but noted differences in emphasis and interpretation, particularly regarding General Gage.

Kennedy's book, The Ride, was released on March 25th. 

- - -

Order the book: The Ride, Paul Revere, and The Night That Saved America, by Kostya Kennedy

Visit Kostya's website at https://kostyakennedy.com

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Sunday, March 23, 2025

ARP347 Constitutional Convention’s Biggest Fight


Last week, we covered how the Constitutional Convention spent about three days setting up the procedures that they would follow and selecting officers to run the Convention.  

On Wednesday, May 30,1787, the Committee of the Whole finally got down to business.  Chairman Nathaniel Gorham brought the committee to order.  Their first point of discussion was the Virginia Plan, introduced by Edmund Randolph, but largely written by James Madison.

Before we dive into that, I want to say that, typically with this podcast, I’ve tried to stick to events in chronological order.  I’m going to depart from this slightly for the next few weeks.  I want to focus on several of the Constitutional debates that occurred during the convention. But the delegates did not just deal with one issue and then move on to the next.  Instead, they debated an issue for a while, they went on to another, then came back to the first one again.  Since I want to focus on this important event over a few episodes, I’m going to take a look at a particular issue or set of issues in each episode, then cover the debate over the course of the entire convention until the delegates reached a final outcome.

Representation in Congress

The biggest issue to be tackled by the convention was how the states would be represented in Congress.  In the Continental Congress, as in the convention itself, each state received one vote.  It did not matter that more than ten times as many people lived in Virginia as did in Delaware, both states got the same one vote.  From the perspective of the Confederation Congress, this made sense.  The Congress was simply a coordinating body between the states on how to deal with Britain and run the war.  It was not involved in making the bulk of the laws that impacted people.  It served essentially as a regional international body that coordinated affairs on behalf of the sovereign states which needed to work together.

Supporters of proportional representation saw this new congress as something that would have more regulatory power.  These representatives in this new congress would be elected directly by the people and would legislate on their behalf.  It made no sense that some people would have much greater say in congress, simply because they lived in a state that had a smaller population.  The seven smallest states made up only about a quarter of the population, but would have a majority say in Congress. That was simply anti-democratic.

Supporters of equal votes for states were more concerned about competing state interests.  Many small states had suffered from having to give in to their larger and more powerful neighbors.  Larger states had frequently set up systems to their own advantage.  Large states would not even have to consider the interests of smaller states.  Virginia, Pennsylvania, North Carolina and Massachusetts contained a majority of the entire population. If they could agree on things, they would never need to do anything that served the interests of the other states.

Before the convention had even begun the Pennsylvania delegates had suggested that proportional representation be a given in the new government.  Anything else would make this new government a collection of states rather than a single united country.  When Delaware’s delegation showed up with instructions that they could not even negotiate on the matter of equal representation of states, it showed that there were many on each side that were fundamentally unwilling to negotiate on this point.

On the very first day of debate, George Reed told the delegates that the Delaware delegation was prepared to walk out and leave the convention if the delegates voted for proportional representation.  It appears that the majority was prepared to support it, no one wanted Delaware to leave on the first day.  After some consideration, they tabled the debate on the issue and moved on to other things.

The issue lay dormant for a couple of weeks until on June 9, William Paterson of New Jersey called for the debate to be renewed.  New Jersey was a leading supporter of equal votes for states.  It was relatively small and was threatened by its larger Pennsylvania and New York neighbors.  The same day that the debate renewed, another leading advocate of the equal votes system arrived at Congress, Luther Martin of Maryland.

The New Jersey delegates argued for a continuation of equal state representation.  In addition to the argument that small states would be overwhelmed in a proportional system, they also argued that the convention did not have the authority to make such fundamental changes to the Confederation Congress.  They were there to suggest a few additional powers, not fundamentally rewrite the power structure.  In response to arguments that that proportional representation was critical to making the government accountable to the people, another New Jersey Delegate, David Brearly offered, a suggestion.  Rather sarcastically, he noted that if states no longer mattered, perhaps they should just redraw all the state lines so that all the states had an equal population.  He knew full well that the larger states were not going to shrink in size so that other states neighbors could grow.

By the end of the day, everyone realized that the majority still supported proportional representation.  The equal states faction once again requested the matter be tabled.

New Jersey Plan

The following week, on June 15, Paterson proposed an entirely new plan in place of the Virginia Plan.  He introduced what came to be known as the New Jersey Plan.  This plan looked much more like what many delegates had envisioned when discussing a federal convention designed to amend the Articles of Confederation, not replace it with a completely new government.

Under the New Jersey Plan, voting in Congress would work the same as it always had under the Articles of Confederation.  There would be a single house and each state would receive one vote.  

Supporters of this plan noted that this convention was not called to create a national government.  It was designed to make some amendments to the Articles of Confederation to make it more workable.  This Confederation consisted of a group of sovereign states that worked together for their common interests.  Creating a Congress where states were represented by population would mean that smaller sovereign states would essentially lose their sovereign status.  They would have no way to prevent larger states from imposing their will on the other states.  Equal voting by states was critical to the sovereignty of smaller states.

Further, there was no need for two houses of Congress.  Each state had a vote in Congress.  Gumming up this process with some elitist second house that could thwart the will of the representative house went against the idea of self-government.  This notion of an upper-house was similar to the House of Lords in Britain.  There was a small group of elites who could thwart the more popular house based on no real legitimate basis, only their elite status.  A single house in Congress was just fine.

So, essentially leaving the basic structure of the Continental Congress as is, the New Jersey plan went on to address the real changes that its supporters thought were necessary to amend the Articles of Confederation.

One of the big problems in the Confederation Congress was the inability to raise money to pay off war debts and other debts.  This plan authorized congress to tax imports, impose a stamp tax, and through postage fees.  Tax evaders would be tried in state courts, but with appeals going to a new federal judiciary.

Congress could also raise additional funds by demanding funds based on a state’s population, including 3/5 of all slaves.  The Confederation Congress already had this power, but the plan advocates suggested giving Congress greater powers of enforcement.

The New Jersey Plan also recommended an executive branch, perhaps a committee, that would be in control of the military and other necessary government functions.  The executive could be removed by a majority of state governors.

The plan also recommended the creation of a federal judiciary, appointed by the Executive and which would hear cases involving impeachments of Federal officers, as well as certain appeals from state courts.

The New Jersey Plan declared that laws by Congress would be the supreme law of the land, thus overruling any conflicting state laws.  State judges would be required to uphold federal laws.  It also gave Congress the power to admit new states into the union, establish a uniform rule of naturalization, and ensure that citizens of each state received equal treatment when they were before courts in other states.  That's a quick summary of the New Jersey Plan.

Under this plan, the Congress would not change much at all from the way it operated under the Articles of Confederation.  Rather, it simply added executive and judicial branches to the mix.  There were a few tweaks like they didn’t need a unanimous vote to requisition taxes from the states, but no major structural changes.

This New Jersey Plan was meant to be a more comprehensive plan, addressing more than simply the question over proportional representation, which is this week's topic.  This was meant to serve as a basis for all the changes the Convention should consider.  For the prior three weeks, all debate had centered around the Virginia Plan, which had recommended an entirely new form of national government.  The New Jersey Plan was designed to bring the overall debate back to the idea of making some reasonable amendments to the Articles of Confederation without completely recreating government from scratch.

These two competing visions would dominate the remainder of the Convention, which still had months of debate to come.  For now though, I just want to focus on how the New Jersey Plan shaped debate over the issue of representation in Congress.

Wealth Representation

Before we return to the continuing debate over proportional vs. equal representation, I should mention that there was another proposal for a different kind of representation.  Several delegates suggested that representation should be based on wealth. This was raise particularly by the South Carolina Delegation, which thought that its slave population, which was a measure of wealth, and which would be included in any system of taxation by the federal government, should also give them a greater number of votes in the Congress.  

The debate over wealth representation was not limited to the slavery question.  Gouverneur Morris, who was an outspoken opponent of slavery at the convention, also supported the idea of wealth representation.  States which contributed more to the federal government in the form of taxes should also have a greater say in the policies of that government.

The idea of representation being tied to the level of taxes given to the government, and that taxes would be tied to the wealth of each state meant that wealthier states that had more taxes would also get more votes.  So this idea had some support in both wealthier free states and in the southern states.  

Later in the convention, this idea was dropped. Southern states were happy to let it drop in favor of representation based on population, as long as 3/5ths of their slaves were counted in the population, in order to give the more power.  The consensus was that this was going to be a republic, which means people should be represented equally.  Wealthier people should not be given additional voting power because of their wealth.

Debate Continues

As a result, the main debate centered around representation based on population vs. equal state representation.  New Jersey plan author Paterson pointed out that a proportional plan where states like Delaware and Georgia had two delegates, would require a house of more than 180 delegates to be proportional.  A second house half that size would increase the size of Congress to an unworkable 270 people.  That seemed absurdly large and would be a great expense to operate.  A single house legislature did not need a second house as a check.  The executive council and the states served as a check on the federal legislature.  That was all that was needed.

All of that day, Friday, and the next Saturday, the delegates argued over the two plans.  James Wilson of Pennsylvania was one of the strongest advocates for proportional representation.  From his point of view, the government was supposed to be from the people.  It was the people who should be represented, not the states.  If each state had equal representation, the people of some states would simply be more powerful than others.  That was completely unacceptable.  

Ironically, at the time, Wilson’s home state of Pennsylvania did not have proportional representation.  Each county, plus the city of Philadelphia, had six representatives.  That was the same, regardless of population.  Some counties had over 30,000 and some had less than 5000, yet each county had the same representation in Pennsylvania's state legislature.

The following day was a Sunday, so both sides had a chance to regroup and consider other options.  On Monday, Alexander Hamilton took the floor for the entire day, criticizing both the Virginia Plan and the New Jersey Plan.  This was the longest speech given at the convention. Hamilton was, by far, the most extreme nationalist at the convention.  He proposed a government that had proportional representation.  But he wanted an elected chief executive who would sit for life and who would appoint all of the state governors.  The president would also have the power to veto all state and local laws.

This was much closer to the colonial model where a king, sitting for life, would appoint all colonial governors.  In fact, Hamilton said that he considered the British model of government, as it was practiced in Britain, “the best in the world.” Many of Hamilton’s extreme views were shared by no one else at the convention.  He could not even get anyone to second his motion to introduce his plan.  Many began calling him a monarchist.  His speech did, however, have the effect of making the Virginia Plan’s radical changes seem more moderate in comparison.

The following day, Madison attacked the New Jersey Plan.  He argued that it did not fix the major defects that existed in the Articles of Confederation.  The states would continue to hold too much power, leaving the federal government impotent.  Foreign powers would continue to try to drive a wedge by negotiating directly with the states.

At the end of the day, a vote was called on the issue.  The delegates voted in favor of proportional representation. By a vote of 7-3-1.  New York’s delegation, despite being a fairly large state, voted in the minority, with the other two delegates outvoting Hamilton. New Jersey, and Delaware also voted in the minority.  Maryland had only two delegates present, cancelling out each other’s vote.

For the rest of the week, the convention debated a number of other issues related to the Virginia Plan, but the equal states faction were not happy.  The only reason they did not walk out of the convention was a hope that they could revisit the issue again.  Delegates realized that even if a majority supported proportional representation, if that meant that four or five states might refuse to join the union under those terms, that would be devastating.

Connecticut Compromise

There was, of course, an obvious compromise.   As early as June 11, even before the introduction of the New Jersey Plan, Connecticut delegate Roger Sherman raised the idea of having the states represented equally in the Senate while having proportional representation in the House.  Neither side was happy with the idea at the time.  The equal states faction still only wanted a single body legislature.  The proportional votes faction saw they had majority support and did not want to give the small states more power in either legislative body.

For the rest of June, the convention did not really reconsider the vote to have proportional representation in both houses.  The equal states faction accepted the reality that they best they could get was equal representation in a single house. That was the so-called Connecticut Compromise, since it had been first introduced by Roger Sherman of Connecticut.

The minority equal states faction still had the power to walk and prevent the convention from having any chance at all for ratification.  Just before the Fourth of July break, Franklin suggested the creation of a “grand committee” to come up with an acceptable compromise.  The committee could consist of one delegate from each state.  Most of the hard core advocates of proportional representation, men like Hamilton, Wilson, and Madison were not placed on the committee.

On July 5, the committee’s chairman, Elbridge Gerry of Massachusetts, reported the committee’s recommendation that the Senate have equal representation for each state and that the House have proportional representation based on population.  

The committee’s recommendations did not settle the matter.  The proportionalists, who knew the majority supported their views, continued to fight.  Madison, Wilson, and Gouverneur Morris continued to argue for proportional representation in both houses over the next ten days.  Their argument was essentially that the small states benefited the most from a union of states and would not walk away from this.  If they did, the large states would probably eventually just conquer the smaller states in open warfare and eventually absorb them.  No one wanted that.

Charles Pinckney proposed a compromise that would put the states into different classes in the Senate.  Larger states would have more representatives in the Senate, but the smaller states would still get disproportionately larger representation than their population justified.  Wilson and Madison got on board with the plan.  They hoped it would be enough for the small states.  The small states, however, suspected they could win on equal representation in the Senate, voted down the compromise.

The following day, July 16, the delegates held a vote on the Grand Committee recommendations.  They approved it 5-4.  Connecticut and North Carolina accepted the compromise, along with smaller states New Jersey, Delaware and Maryland.  New York probably would have voted yes as well, but its delegates had already left the convention, and so New York did not vote at all.  Massachusetts was tied and did not vote.

While the hard core supporters of proportional representation, men like Madison and Wilson, were not happy with this outcome, they accepted the result and did not try to revisit the issue for the rest of the convention.

Next week, we’ll look at the other issues regarding the creation of a new federal Congress.

- - -

Next Episode 348 Convention Creates a Legislature 

Previous Episode 346 The Constitutional Convention Begins

 Contact me via email at mtroy.history@gmail.com

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Further Reading

Websites

Secret Proceedings and Debates of the Convention Assembled at Philadelphia, in the Year 1787, Richmond; Wilbur Curtiss, 1839. 

Brant, Irving James Madison: Father of the Constitution, 1787-1800. Bobbs-Merrill Co. 1950 (borrow only). 

Donovan, Frank R. Mr. Madison’s Constitution: The Story Behind the Constitutional Convention, New York: Dodd, Mead & Co. 1965 (borrow only) 

Farrand, Max The Framing of the Constitution of the United States, Yale Univ. Press, 1913. 

Farrand, Max (ed) The Records of the Federal Convention of 1787Vol. 1Vol. 2, and Vol 3, Yale Univ. Press, 1911.  

Ford, Worthington, Chauncey The Federal Constitution in Virginia, 1787-1788. Cambridge: University Press, 1903. 

Jameson, J. Franklin Studies in the History of the Federal Convention of 1787, Washington: Government Printing Office, 1903. 

Madison, James Notes of Debates in the Federal Convention of 1787, Ohio Univ. Press, 1966. 

McMaster, John Bach (ed) Pennsylvania and the Federal Constitution: 1787-1788, Historical Society of Pennsylvania, 1888. 

Meigs, William M. The Growth of the Constitution in the Federal Convention of 1787, Philadelphia: J.B. Lippincott Co. 1900. 

Richardson, Hamilton P. The Journal of the Federal Convention of 1787 Analyzed, San Francisco: Murdock Press, 1899. 

Scott, James B. James Madison's notes of debates in the Federal convention of 1787, New York: Oxford Univ. Press, 1918. 

Books Worth Buying
(links to Amazon.com unless otherwise noted)*

Amar, Akhil Reed America’s Constitution: A Biography, Random House 2005. 

Beeman, Richard R. Plain, Honest Men: The Making of the American Constitution, Random House, 2009. 

Bowen, Catherine Drinker Miracle at Philadelphia: The Story of the Constitutional Convention, Little, Brown & Co. 1966 (borrow at archive.org).

Collier, Christopher Decision in Philadelphia: The Constitutional Convention of 1787, Random House, 1986 (borrow at archive.org).

Morris, Richard B. Witnesses at the Creation: Hamilton, Madison, Jay and the Constitution, Holt, Rinehart & Winston, 1985. 

Rossiter, Clinton 1787: The Grand Convention, Macmillan Co. 1966 (borrow on archive.org).

Smith, Page The Constitution: A Documentary and Narrative History, Morrow Quill, 1978. 

Stewart, David O. The Summer of 1787: The Men Who Invented the Constitution, Simon & Schuster, 2007. 

* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

 



Sunday, March 16, 2025

ARP346 The Constitutional Convention Begins

Last week we covered the events leading up to the Constitutional Convention.  This week, we will take a look at the start of the convention and how the delegates set up the procedures for the convention itself.

The Convention Begins

As I mentioned last week, the Convention was supposed to begin on Monday May 14, 1787.  Only two state delegations showed up that day, so the delegates that did just had to sit around and wait.  Many of them used that time to chat informally amongst themselves, hanging out in bars or in someone’s parlor to exchange ideas.  

James Madison
I guess technically there was no minimum requirement since the Convention had not yet set any standards.  The delegates, however, did not want to look like a tiny minority was setting rules for everyone else. They informally accepted the requirement under the Articles of Confederation that delegates from at least seven states, in other words a majority of the thirteen states, were present.

The delegates had to wait nearly two weeks until the New Jersey delegation finally showed up on Friday, May 25.  They were the seventh state delegation to show up, enough to make a quorum and begin their business. There were at least partial delegations from New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Virginia, North Carolina, and South Carolina.  There was also a single delegate from Massachusetts and one from Georgia.  But the Convention decided that at least two delegates must be present from each state in order to represent that state.

The convention met in the east room of the Pennsylvania State House, what we call Independence Hall today.  This was the same 40x40 foot room where the Continental Congress had met when it was in Philadelphia.  By this time, of course, the Continental Congress had been meeting in New York city for several years.

The room was set up with tables so that each state delegation could sit together.  The tables were  covered with green table cloths that matched the window drapes, and surrounded by wooden Windsor chairs.  The delegations were arranged by geography with the northern state delegations seated at tables at the northern end of the room, then the middle state delegations in the middle, and the southern delegations on the southern side of the room.

There were never more than eleven delegations there at any time.  Rhode Island never sent a delegation.  The New Hampshire delegation did not arrive until July.  By the time New Hampshire arrived, the New York delegation had left.  The states had selected a  total of seventy-four men to serve  as delegates. Only 55 of those actually attended the convention.  Many of the conventions came and went, being absent sometimes for days or weeks at a time.  On most days, there were probably no more than thirty or forty delegates present.  Of those, maybe about twenty of them formed the hard core that were there for most of the Convention and did most of the work on the Constitution.

On that first day, the convention accepted the credentials of the 29 delegates from seven states that were present that day.  Normally, this would be a rather boring and pro forma event.  But when the Delaware delegation presented its credentials, it noted its instructions required that the delegation not accept any change that altered the one-state, one-vote power structure that existed in the Articles of Confederation.  Since there were a great many delegates who thought that was one of the biggest problems that needed to be fixed, those limiting instructions which set a line in the sand before debate even began, created an immediate frustration.  That said, this was not the time to argue over that.  Such a time would come later.

With the state delegation credentials completed, the next thing for the Convention was to pick a president.  That is, someone to preside over the Convention.  There really was no debate over this.  Robert Morris of Pennsylvania rose to nominate George Washington.  The honor of nominating Washington was supposed to go to Benjamin Franklin, but he was too sick to attend that day.  The 81 year old Franklin was becoming quite enfeebled by this time, frequently bedridden with gout or other ailments.  Franklin had to be carried to the convention. The warden of the Walnut Street Prison had sent trustee-prisoners, four of them, to carry Franklin in a sedan chair from his home which was about a block and a half from the state house.  Despite his condition, Franklin had made the trip several times, only to have to turn around and go home due to the lack of a quorum.  It’s not clear why Franklin stayed home on the Friday when the convention finally reached a quorum.  By some accounts, he was having a flare up of his kidney stones.  It was also raining particularly hard that morning.  For whatever reason, Franklin missed the first day, and requested that Robert Morris take up the honor of nominating Washington as president.

Typically a nomination might begin by singing the praises of the nominee.  In this case, there was little need.  Everyone knew Washington was the man.  Morris only noted that he made the nomination on behalf of instructions by the Pennsylvania state delegation.  John Rutledge of South Carolina was given the honor of seconding Washington’s nomination.  He only added that he was confident that the choice would be unanimous.  He was right.  It was unanimous.  No one else was even nominated.

Washington rose to thank the Convention for the honor, then fell into a short “aw shucks” response, much like when he was selected as Commander in Chief of the Continental Army.  He told the delegates he lamented his lack of better qualifications and asked for their indulgence in advance for any errors he might make.

When Morris and Rutledge escorted Washington to the chair, Madison took a seat right in front of Washington so that he could take notes.  Madison had appointed himself to take notes.  No one asked him to do this.  

In fact, Congress selected William Jackson to serve as the Convention’s secretary on that first day as well.  Jackson was responsible for taking notes during the Convention.  Jackson had been an aide-de-camp to General Benjamin Lincoln during the war.  After the war, he became an attorney and acted as a business agent for Robert Morris.  This appears to have been the most contentious vote of the day. James Wilson of Pennsylvania nominated Benjamin Franklin’s grandson, Temple Franklin to serve as secretary.  Again, I would have guessed Benjamin Franklin himself would have made the nomination had he not been sick in bed.  Hamilton nominated Jackson.  The vote by state went for Jackson by a vote of five to two.

So why was Madison taking notes when it was Jackson's job to do this? Madison did not trust Jackson, or anyone else, to keep a full record of the debates.  On that point he was correct.  Jackson only recorded formal motions and votes.  He did not record any of the debate over those motions.   Madison believed the record of the debates would be very important and therefore took it upon himself to record them.  As a result, Madison’s notes are the best record we have of the debates at the Convention.

The Convention did not really dive into any other issues that day.  Instead, it also appointed Nicholas Weaver as the messenger for the convention and Joseph Fry as door-keeper.  Both men served in similar roles for the Pennsylvania legislature which normally met in that same room.

With the clerical appointments done, the delegates turned to the creation of a rules committee that would determine how the Convention would work.  After that it adjourned until Monday.

Rules of the Convention

George Wythe of Virginia would serve as chair the rules committee.  He was a longtime attorney and legislator who had served in the Virginia legislature for decades and had also served in the Continental Congress.  In Virginia, he had served on the committee, along with Thomas Jefferson, to re-codify all of the state’s laws after independence.  He also served as a judge and a law professor during and after the war.

Also appointed to the rules committee was Charles Pickney of South Carolina.   Pickney was one of the youngest delegates at the convention, still in his late 20s.  He was a Charleston lawyer, and had served in the South Carolina militia during the war.  He had been taken prisoner when the British captured Charleston in 1780.  Since he was a militia officer, and not a Continental officer, he was paroled after a few months.  He served in the Continental Congress after the war and had been a vocal advocate in the Congress to approve this Convention.

The final member of the committee was New York delegate, Alexander Hamilton.  I'm not going to get into much detail on Hamilton's background.  You should know this already. He was about the same age as Pickney.  Hamilton had served as an aide to Washington during the war, before moving to an independent command.  He was appointed to the Continental Congress near the end of the war

After the war, he began a legal practice in New York City.  Marrying into the powerful Schuyler family, increased Hamilton’s stature, but he had a pretty strong reputation on his own for a young man with no respected family of his own.

Hamilton had a reputation of dominating most committees where he was appointed.  But by most accounts, Wythe dominated the drafting of the rule.  Hamilton certainly had input, but Wythe chaired the committee and was very much the senior to the other two members.

The committee worked over the weekend and reported the rules on Monday.  By that time a few more delegates had arrived, including delegates from Connecticut and Maryland.  This brought the total number of state delegations to nine. 

The delegates voted on the recommendations of the rules committee.  One of the most controversial rules, at least for those not in attendance at the convention, was secrecy.  In order to encourage free and open debate on all issues, there would be no public records of the debates.  Delegates had to take an oath that they would not speak or write about anything that happened during the convention until after it had ended.  Sentries would be stationed by the doors to prevent any spectators or journalists from trying to overhear debates.  At one point during the debates, they moved upstairs to a second floor room in the State House so they could open windows to help endure the summer heat, but wanted to make sure people were not listening by the open windows.

The rule regarding secrecy might seem rather anti-democratic today.  But keep in mind that the convention was not really a group of lawmakers.  They were there simply to come up with recommendations for other people to enact.  

The members took the secrecy requirement very seriously.  George Washington even stopped recording discussions in his private diary.  There were a few minor leaks.  French officials recorded some information about the convention in letters home,  indicating they had talked to someone inside.  At one point, early in the convention, someone dropped a copy of the Virginia plan outside the meeting chamber.  Washington sternly admonished the delegates to be more careful.  There were a few private letters that were later discovered to have discussed some matters before the convention, but amazingly nothing really found itself into the public newspapers or the public discourse until the convention ended.

A second rule involved reconsideration of votes.  They would take votes on issues over the course of the convention, but a vote deciding a matter would not mean it was final.  Delegates could bring any matter up for reconsideration, as long as they gave a day’s notice.  While there was an argument that this could prevent the convention from actually making any progress since no issue would ever be finalized, it was necessary since votes on controversial issues might cause some delegations to walk out of the convention.  Knowing that they could have a chance to reconsider the matter in the future meant that they could stay and continue to debate.

Voting would be done by state, not by individuals.  Since states had sent wildly differing sized delegations, and those delegation sizes had nothing to do with the size or power of the state, offering individual votes made little sense.  For example, New York had three delegates present.  Delaware had five.  The Pennsylvania delegation wanted each delegation to have voting power more proportionate with its own population, but several delegations from small states threatened to walk out.  In the end, the delegates agreed that each state delegation would decide amongst themselves how that state would cast its single vote.

The delegates also agreed that a quorum to do any business would require the presence of delegates from at least seven states.  The convention also approved some more basic rules, like an instruction that memes would not read, gossip among themselves, nor interrupt when someone else was speaking.  Anyone speaking would address their remarks to the President, and that no delegate, unless given special leave, would speak twice on a subject before every delegate had a chance to speak.  Any member who spoke out of order could be called to order, not only by the chair, but by any other delegate.  There were other basic rules of procedure, which I won’t cover in more detail here.  No one wants me to discuss parliamentary procedure for the entire episode.

The rules committee also recommended a rule that any delegate could call for a roll-call vote on any motion.  The majority of delegates voted down this recommendation.  George Mason argued that putting delegates on the record with a position might make it more difficult for them to change their minds later.  Following the establishment of the rules for the convention, the delegates adjourned for the day.

While not a formal rule, the convention met for about five hours a day, six days a week, taking off only Sundays and for the Fourth of July holiday.  There would also be a break later in the summer. The reason for relatively short days in session was that it gave delegates time to go out and have even more informal discussions with each other as a way of coming to consensus.  Because of the secrecy rule, they could not speak with others outside the Convention, but could speak with each other in a more casual environment.

Introducing the Virginia Plan

The following day, Edmund Randolph of Virginia rose to introduce the resolution that the Articles of Confederation ought to be “corrected and enlarged” to ensure the “common defense, security of Liberty, and general welfare.”  This made clear at the outset that the convention was going to have a broad mandate, not just matters of trade.  

His introductory speech mentioned the commercial discord that had arisen between states, some states like Massachusetts had dealt with internal rebellions, paper money was causing havoc, and states were violating treaties.  The current articles gave the Congress no power to prepare for foreign invasions, to enforce treaties, to raise money, to establish commercial regulations, or really prevent the states from doing anything they wanted.  He feared the United States could fall into anarchy and fulfill the prophecies of those who predicted that a republic could not stand on its own without a king.

As head of the Virginia delegation, Governor Randolph introduced Madison’s draft plan for a new constitution, the so-called Virginia Plan that I discussed last week.  Among its more controversial recommendations was a congress where states would be represented by population rather than the old one-state, one-vote standard.  Again, I won’t go over all the proposals again here, but we will get into them as the debate begins.

The important thing to remember is that it was the Virginia Plan that would become the basis of discussion as the Convention began its debate.  

Committee of the Whole

To begin debate on the Virginia Plan, the Convention voted to meet as a Committee of the Whole.  This was a common parliamentary fiction used at the time, and still used today.  A committee of the whole means everyone at the convention sat on the committee.  The point of doing this was to allow debate and discussion to remain informal and to avoid the more rigid parliamentary rules that would apply when the Convention met in regular session.

It also meant that Washington would not have to sit at the head of the Convention all day, every day.  The convention voted Nathaniel Gorham to sit as chairman of the Committee of the Whole.  During this time, Washington took his seat with the Virginia delegation and acted just like any other delegate.  In this role, Washington was free to debate just like any other delegate.  Even so, the general mostly kept his mouth shut.  He only rose to speak once during the entire convention, and it was on a relatively minor point near the end of the convention.

Washington knew that his name and reputation gave his words far more power than he would have liked.  He did not want to be seen as bullying the delegates. Even simply by arguing a point just like any other delegate, he words would have more power and receive more deference than any other delegate would get.  Instead, he kept a low profile.  This is not to say that he never expressed an opinion.  Washington regularly spent time outside of the convention, speaking informally with other delegates and sharing his opinion on things.  He just didn’t want to be seen as dominating the debate at the convention itself.  While the delegates debated in the Committee of the Whole, Washington tried to stay above the fray.

Gorham of Massachusetts was a long time legislator, serving in the Provincial Congress and the Massachusetts legislature.  He was also a delegate at the Massachusetts Constitutional Convention and a state judge.  Gorham had also recently served as President of the Continental Congress.

The selection of Gorham appears to have been pretty uncontroversial, and perhaps decided in outside discussions ahead of time.  The vote was seven to one, with the one vote going to John Rutledge of South Carolina.  The vote was taken in secret, but I’ve seen other historians speculate that the vote for Rutledge came from Gorham himself, just to appear humble and keep the vote from being unanimous.

Once Gorham took his seat at the head of the convention, the Committee of the Whole took up the Virginia Plan as the matter under debate.

Next week: we will dive into that debate, and will cover the most controversial issue that the convention would face.

- - -

Next Episode 347 Constitutional Convention's Biggest Fight 

Previous Episode 345 Planning a Constitutional Convention

 Contact me via email at mtroy.history@gmail.com

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American Revolution Podcast is distributed 100% free of charge. If you can chip in to help defray my costs, I'd appreciate whatever you can give.  Make a one time donation through my PayPal account. You may also donate via Venmo (@Michael-Troy-20) or Zelle (send to mtroy1@yahoo.com)


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You can support the American Revolution Podcast as a Patreon subscriber.  This is an option making monthly pledges.  Patreon support will give you access to Podcast extras and help make the podcast a sustainable project.

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Further Reading

Websites

Adams, John A Defence of the Constitutions of Government of the United States, London: C. Dilly, 1787: 

Brant, Irving James Madison: Father of the Constitution, 1787-1800. Bobbs-Merrill Co. 1950 (borrow only). 

Donovan, Frank R. Mr. Madison’s Constitution: The Story Behind the Constitutional Convention, New York: Dodd, Mead & Co. 1965 (borrow only) 

Farrand, Max (ed) The Records of the Federal Convention of 1787Vol. 1Vol. 2, and Vol 3, Yale Univ. Press, 1911.  

Ford, Worthington, Chauncey The Federal Constitution in Virginia, 1787-1788. Cambridge: University Press, 1903. 

Jameson, J. Franklin Studies in the History of the Federal Convention of 1787, Washington: Government Printing Office, 1903. 

Madison, James Notes of Debates in the Federal Convention of 1787, Ohio Univ. Press, 1966. 

McMaster, John Bach (ed) Pennsylvania and the Federal Constitution: 1787-1788, Historical Society of Pennsylvania, 1888. 

Richardson, Hamilton P. The Journal of the Federal Convention of 1787 Analyzed, San Francisco: Murdock Press, 1899. 

Scott, James B. James Madison's notes of debates in the Federal convention of 1787, New York: Oxford Univ. Press, 1918. 


Books Worth Buying
(links to Amazon.com unless otherwise noted)*

Amar, Akhil Reed America’s Constitution: A Biography, Random House 2005. 

Beeman, Richard R. Plain, Honest Men: The Making of the American Constitution, Random House, 2009. 

Bowen, Catherine Drinker Miracle at Philadelphia: The Story of the Constitutional Convention, Little, Brown & Co. 1966 (borrow at archive.org).

Collier, Christopher Decision in Philadelphia: The Constitutional Convention of 1787, Random House, 1986 (borrow at archive.org).

Morris, Richard B. Witnesses at the Creation: Hamilton, Madison, Jay and the Constitution, Holt, Rinehart & Winston, 1985. 

Rossiter, Clinton 1787: The Grand Convention, Macmillan Co. 1966 (borrow on archive.org).

Smith, Page The Constitution: A Documentary and Narrative History, Morrow Quill, 1978. 

Stewart, David O. The Summer of 1787: The Men Who Invented the Constitution, Simon & Schuster, 2007. 

* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.